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Better Brindle Breakout not giving Brindle?
  • So I used BBB to get this fella...
    image
    BFR 10157001 Sacrifice Ebony


    Chimera, bay on both sides, and that's all. No brindle on the coat at all! The description of the HH says it will always be brindle.

    ETA: I have refreshed the image seed, so you can kind of see the brindle I guess.
    Edit2: I appreciate everyone helping me understand the way the game works! And thank you Ammit for changing my boy for me, he's beautiful!
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • He is, but because both sides are so similar, there is not much difference in coat color. I can see the splotches from brindle on his stomach. Subtle.
  • All I see on his stomach is the slightly different shade of bay from the chimera.
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • That is exactly what you are supposed to see. If you don't like patchy chimera and want brindle stripes instead you can pay for a new seed. The patches are much rarer.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • Is Chimera and Brindle the same thing, just different appearances? I think I am very confused.
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • If I’m correct, chimera is brindle, it’s the same thing, I think the name just updated when Ammit upgraded the the way we view and modify it. I believe before it was just “bay brindle” with the one genetic code, where now it’s “bay and bay” with two genetic codes?
    But chimera is the new term for brindle, you can reroll any chimera/brindle horse many times and get thin or thick “stripes” or get blotches, but the blotches are more rare to come across

    ETA: I do stand corrected, it is not the same thing as others have explained here (sorry about that!), the more I think I know the more I learn that I do not know lol.
  • Brindle is the stripey phenotype. Chimeria means two sets of DNA. Many chimeras have brindle stripes, some have patches. If you want stripes instead of patches you can pay for a new image seed.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • If you are asking why your horse is not a loud brindle it is because not all brindles have loud markings. It does not make them less of a brindle.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • I've just never heard before that chimera and brindle are the same thing, just having different expressions.
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • Its not the same. Being chimera gives them the ability to have 2 different sets of genes. Because they have 2 different sets of genes, they have the ability to have 2 different patterns. Think 2 horses in one and everytime you reroll, you get a different version of that horse.
    Aspen Farms #48077|Aspen Farms Exchange-Public Chat
  • They are not the same thing. Brindle is a pattern, chimera is one of the things that CAN but does not always cause the pattern.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • @AspenFarms I know what chimera is, but the way brindle being explained here is really melting my brain.

    I am being told that my supposed-to-be-brindle horse is showing patches of chimera instead ("as it should"), and if I want to see the brindle I need to pay to refresh the image seed.

    I am not understanding this at all, which is impressive because I've studied equine genetics for nearly three decades.
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • From my understanding, if the horse is chimera they will throw either the splochy pattern or brindle. So if you reroll, you *should* get brindle. From what Ive read, its incredibly rare to breed brindle in the game.
    Aspen Farms #48077|Aspen Farms Exchange-Public Chat
  • I think you're getting conflicting answers.

    Chimerism usually causes stripes in game, but it can cause patches instead. See examples:
    image
    SB G1H Days Massive

    (more obvious)

    image
    SB G1L Agonizing Outlets

    (Very subtle)

    image
    SB G1H Floating Pepper


    Your horse is exhibiting the striped Brindle phenotype. You can add sooty or DP to get one side darker, re-roll to see if you can get a higher contrast image seed or a patched phenotype, or add a pinto pattern/up the white factor to make it more noticeable brindle.
    Thanked by 1KeenBTF
  • @aspenfarms
    But since he was made using the better brindle HH, shouldn't he show brindle and not chimera? It seems as if it is being used interchangeably, which is what is confusing me. If they have brindle, are they also automatically chimera?

    @silverborn
    That last horse especially is super gorgeous! I hope my brain figures out this chimera/brindle thing lol I guess it doesn't really matter if I don't get it, but learning is my passion XD
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • So to answer your other question: all chimeras in game either show brindle stripes or patching. Brindle can describe either a chimeric (2 sets of DNA) horse, or a dun with hom dun factor promoter 1 (one set of DNA, but the color name ends in "brindle"). I think that's causing some of the confusion here.

    In real life, chimeras can be brindle or patched, and some somatic mutations cause brindle striping without the 2 sets of DNA. It's similar in game, but not exactly the same.

    The in game chimeras are distinguished by one single gene on one strand being different. For example, on my first two examples, there's a sooty on one strand but not the other. The third example has a cream on one strand. That's for the foundation horses. If you breed them and get a rare second gen chimeric foal, they can have any combination of parent genes on either strand. I have one example of a lined chimera I purchased and she's bay on one and black appaloosa on the other:

    image
    SB 2B Individually


    You can see both parents are foundation chimeras with the single gene difference in the two strands.
    Thanked by 1KeenBTF
  • Oooh okay, thank you! So if the game uses chimera to give the brindle, it doesn't list it in the genes or color name, but if it uses DFP1 then it has brindle in the color name. There is not just a "brindle" gene that it gives with the HH. Is this right or am I way off?
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • Brindle is striping nothing more. Multiple things can cause stripes.

    All the people telling you bridle means chimeric are flat-out wrong. Brindle means stripes and that is it. Brindle does not mean chimeric.

    Chimerism is one one the things that can cause brindle stripes. The herd helper makes chimeric horses. Any chimeric horse in the game can be brindle with the right image seed.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • You're right! There are other rank special herd helpers that cause chimerism - the two drafts I posted were from some of those. I'm not sure if it's possible to make a chimera without one of the herd helpers that guarantees it. I'm guessing that if it is, it's very rare.
  • . Brindle can describe either ...


    Brindle describes stripes that is it. Chimerism and DFP1 can result in brindle stripes. Brindle does not describe chimerism or DFP1. Brindle is a look, not a gene, not a genetic condition.

    The in game chimeras are distinguished by one single gene on one strand being different.


    Chimeric horses in-game can have any number of different genes just like real life. Chimeric only means DNA from two different animals.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • silverborn there are many ways in the game to make chimerism.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • Well, now I'm confused again..
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • Rockin BFR - chimerism, which is one way to make brindle means a horse has two sets of DNA. DFP1 is also called inheritable brindle. The dun version of brindle is completely unrelated to chimeric brindle. They look similar but have totally different causes. The kind of brindle you have is not genetic so it is not part of the color name.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • Unfortunately, members who are trying to help are giving you a lot of incorrect information in this thread. :(
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • So what exactly does the Better Brindle HH do please?
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • When you create a foundation horse with a "brindle" herd helper it will create a horse for you with two sets of DNA. This is called chimerism. In real life, sometimes chimeric animals have stripes. Often they do not. Chimerism often hides. In the game, chimerism can be totally hidden or very loud. Just like real life, it does not always show.

    In real life, chimerism is one way that brindle stripes are formed. The other ways are a gene called inheritable brindle, and "skewing" where a normal marking like gray or roan gets all twisted up in utero and makes stripes. All versions of stripes are called brindle. Brindle just means stripes. It is frequently impossible to just look at a brindle horse and know what caused the brindle stripes.

    The game has chimerism and inheritable brindle as the ways you can get brindle stripes. Only when a horse has inheritable brindle (Dun factor promoter) will the word brindle show in the name.

    Chimerism is not inheritable in real life or in the game, but because this is a game chimeric horses have an increased chance of producing chimeric foals (with or without brindle stripes). Also, chimeric horses in the game are far more likely to have visible brindle stripes than in real life.

    The three ways to get chimeric horses in the game are 1) from herd helpers with the brindle tag 2) as a rare result of breeding and 3) by merging two horses together in the GMT lab.

    I hope that clears some stuff up. Please if you have specific things you want to be clarified just ask. I am happy to give more detail where things might be unclear.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
  • Any herd helper that is tagged with brindle will create a horse for you with two sets of DNA. The second set will always have a random allele mutated to something else. Sometimes this results in very loud stripes. Sometimes it is completely invisible. There is a very high chance you will get a brindle from a brindle herd helper but it is not guaranteed.

    On your horse, the mutation is on pangare. Not a very loud mutation.
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
    Thanked by 1KeenBTF
  • "The second set will always have a random allele mutated to something else."

    That's what I was trying to say when I misspoke and said that the difference is one gene between the two pairs. I've only ever seen one difference on all my herd-helper-created brindles. Apologies for my inaccuracies.
    Thanked by 1KeenBTF
  • All right, thank you for explaining! I know about brindle in real life (the inheritable version that is basically a different edited gene), but TIL that chimera often has brindle as well. It's an interesting link that I will have to explore and learn about.
    So the Brindle HH is really more of a Chimera HH and you can get brindle as a result, if I am understanding correctly. I will see about adding a gene to this boy to make his brindle pop a little more. I did pay for the re-roll but it is only *slightly* more visible lol
    Thanks everyone for helping my brain wrap around this whole thing. I really appreciate it!
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.
  • Yup sounds like you got it!

    To help you out I added to your horse for you. Now it has very clear stripes :).
    Need to contact me? Read this first. Only send me a PM for PayPal issues or if I ask you to. Otherwise, make a forum post. You will get a better faster answer by making a post.

    I sometimes get busy and miss things. If your private message, question, etc. gets missed please ping me so I can follow up with you. I am also always happy to explain or clarify. (HAJ does not have a customer service email, please send me a forum message! )


    she/her
    Thanked by 1KeenBTF
  • Oh my gosh, thank you Ammit!
    Hey there! I am an Autistic adult (have patience please) with a great love of horses and anything to do with genetics. I have only been active for a short while so I am learning my way around.

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